Interview with Edgar Miranda, April 10, 2017

00:00:00KATE DAHLSTRAND: It is 10/21 on April 10th, 2017. And my name is Kate Dahlstrand. If you could state your name, branch of service, how many years you served--

00:00:17EDGAR MIRANDA: My name is Edgar Miranda. I was in the Marine Corps for eight years.

00:00:22DAHLSTRAND: Okay. Why don't we start just by telling me-- Why did you join the military? Where are you from?

00:00:31MIRANDA: I'm originally from Los Angeles, California. And I joined because by the time I graduated high school, I had no set plan to do anything. But I also am from East LA, where it's-- If you stay there, you're going to stay there forever, kind of thing. I knew that I didn't want to stay in my hometown forever. And I joined to get out.

00:01:02DAHLSTRAND: Okay. What year did you graduate from high school?

00:01:05MIRANDA: 2007.

00:01:06DAHLSTRAND: 2007. So, when did you join the military?

00:01:09MIRANDA: About two weeks after high school graduation.

00:01:12DAHLSTRAND: Two weeks! Wow! So did you have this plan set going into your senior year?

00:01:16MIRANDA: Oh yeah, definitely. I don't know-- I didn't know what I wanted to do. And the rest of my friends did. I knew that if I, you know, just stayed and went to community college at home that I would end up dropping out or finding a job somewhere-- you know-- dead-end job kind of thing. The recruiter sought me out from a list of phone numbers. And, you know-- He was very convincing. And I knew that I needed a change and that I-- you know-- I could do it. So, I went for it.

00:01:58DAHLSTRAND: So, why the Marine Corps?

00:02:01MIRANDA: Um, I figured if I'm gonna-- 'cause also this was during, you know, Iraq in 2007 and Afghanistan, but, um-- I figured if I'm going to get deployed, I want to be as well trained as possible. So, I joined the Marine Corps.

00:02:18DAHLSTRAND: Okay. Did you come from a military family? Did any of your relatives have any military service?

00:02:29MIRANDA: My eldest brother-- He's 48 now. I'm the youngest, obviously.

00:02:38DAHLSTRAND: Of how many?

00:02:39MIRANDA: Four. And he's a Gulf War veteran. Oh, I'm sorry-- Desert Storm veteran. Same thing. And then one of my other older cousins-- which is about-- He's about the same age as my brother. He's also a veteran-- a Marine Corps veteran-- But otherwise, we were the only three.

00:02:59DAHLSTRAND: So you're the first generation-- But-- Okay--

00:03:03MIRANDA: Yeah, definitely.

00:03:04DAHLSTRAND: Okay. When you joined-- Tell me-- What was your specialty? What was your job description?

00:03:12MIRANDA: I was a-- It's a long title. [Laughing] But at the time-- I'm sure they've changed the name of it. But it was a 28 47. It's a Telephone Systems and Computer Repairman. So, that was just one small subset of that field-- of that occupational field-- where we dealt with, you know, the telephones, and peripherals, and satellites, and everything. But, you know-- Obviously there were other specialties within that field. So, that's what I did.

00:03:52DAHLSTRAND: Okay, was that your choice? Is that what you wanted to do?

00:03:58MIRANDA: I was very naive when I was told about my contract. Because I wasn't aware that-- you know-- Sometimes when you sign a contract, it's an option. So, you know-- They can put you in any of those fields that are listed. And for the most part, I was okay with it. But that occupational field is definitely-- I'm going to brag about it because 2800s are definitely cocky-- But we're the smart ones of the Marine Corps. I mean, our GT score has to be 120 or above. Our school is about a year and a half long.

00:04:42DAHLSTRAND: Where was that?

00:04:43MIRANDA: In Twentynine Palms, California. It was horrible.

00:04:50DAHLSTRAND: Explain that. How is it-- How is it horrible?

00:04:52MIRANDA: It's in the middle of nowhere, completely in the middle of nowhere. It's about an hour east of Palm Springs. So it's just desert, complete desert. It's the biggest training base that the Marine Corps has. And you know-- That's where they do all the flyovers and the artillery ranges and stuff. And I mean-- It's so in the middle of nowhere. It's yeah-- It's crazy.

00:05:19DAHLSTRAND: But did you have any free time?

00:05:22MIRANDA: Yeah, definitely. I mean-- It was-- It was the schoolhouse as we call it. It was-- you know, we-- It was training, you know. You went to class, you-- I mean, you still did PT and stuff with your class, your platoon-- But, you know-- The main goal was to pass your courses. And I mean-- The courses were very, you know, academically intense. Because, you know, we had to learn electronic theory. And it was just something that I didn't think I would have to do. And it was actually pretty intense because, you know--

00:06:03MIRANDA: By the end of the courses you're essentially an underqualified electronical-- what's the word-- electronic engineer. Because you have to diagnose surrogates. You have to replace surrogate boards, micro-miniatures, surrogate board repair-- So we're basically the more affordable warranty people for all the Marine Corps equipment. So if something breaks that's out of warranty, we're the ones that have to dive in there and do surgery. So-- But I mean-- It was intense. But I also didn't do my job very much.

00:06:39DAHLSTRAND: No? Why not?

00:06:43MIRANDA: As soon as I was an NCO, I was put in the training section. And I was in charge of training for the entire company-- for the communications company. And we had everything in the company. We had the operators, which actually operated the equipment. We had the technicians, which were us. We had the more transport people. We had-- What else do we have? We also had the Data Network Operations Center, which is the hub for all communications from the 1st Marine Division coming in from Afghanistan and Iraq. So it was a very operationally inclined unit. It was like we all knew at some point we were going to deploy.

00:07:32DAHLSTRAND: So when you were done with training at Twentynine Palms, where was your first duty station?

00:07:39MIRANDA: Oh, I was in Okinawa, Japan.

00:07:41DAHLSTRAND: Okay. For how long?

00:07:43MIRANDA: Two years.

00:07:44DAHLSTRAND: And what was that like?

00:07:45MIRANDA: I was about 19 to 21 while I was there. And I think that I was too young to appreciate it because even when I was at Twentynine Palms-- That's even though it's the middle of nowhere-- It's about two hours home to LA-- And, you know, every chance I got I would go home. And going from never really leaving home because you know-- I went to boot camp in San Diego. I went to combat training at Camp Pendleton. Then went, you know-- two hours away and in Twentynine Palms. I never really left home for the first about two, year and a half--

00:08:25DAHLSTRAND: Okay. So you got out without getting out.

00:08:30MIRANDA: Yeah, basically. Yeah. Yeah. And then-- Which was fine, because, you know-- I was finally had a job and finally had my own money. And I had my own car. Like it was-- It was alright. But you know-- Once I went to Japan, you know, you couldn't drive. You were there for two years. You walked everywhere. And, you know-- You're 6,000 miles away from home. And you're, I mean, technically still a teenager. You're 19. And it was just-- I don't want to say culture shock-- But it was definitely-- I was definitely homesick for a long time. I think the first like year and a half that I was there-- I was not happy.

00:09:08DAHLSTRAND: Did you do any traveling while you were there?

00:09:11MIRANDA: I went to Seoul-- or not Seoul. Well, we went to Seoul when we went to North Korea. We took an HSV, which is a high speed vessel-- which is basically just a small, or rather a big yacht sized thing. And it's just-- It's not a big Navy ship. But it's-- you know. It's used for transporting Marines. And I mean, it has no missiles on it. It's completely ridiculous. I felt nervous being on it the entire time because, you know, we're in international waters. But whatever.

00:09:45MIRANDA: But we went to South Korea. And from there, you know-- We did get liberty every once in a while. We were there for about two months. And we got to go to Seoul and that was pretty cool. But-- I mean, otherwise, like I was saying-- I think I was too wrapped around me being unhappy that I didn't go anywhere. Like I knew plenty of people that would take leave and go to Thailand-- and go to the mainland, at least Tokyo. And I didn't do that. I think that if I were there now, I would do it differently. But no-- I mean, I only went to Okinawa and to Korea.

00:10:30DAHLSTRAND: Okay. So where did you go after Japan? Once your tour in Japan was over, what happened?

00:10:35MIRANDA: I went to Camp Pendleton, 1st Marine Division, Headquarters Battalion, Communications Company. And that's when the-- I guess Combat Op Temple went up. Because, you know-- We were part of the 1st Marine Division. You're going to get deployed. And I remember when I first joined, I was very weary of that. But, you know-- After being in Japan for two years and not doing anything-- Eventually you feel like you're not doing your part. And, you know-- Once I got ordered to 1st Marine Division, I was really excited because I knew that I would finally get to do my part. So, but um--

00:11:17DAHLSTRAND: So have you deployed to either Iraq or Afghanistan?

00:11:21MIRANDA: Just Afghanistan.

00:11:22DAHLSTRAND: Afghanistan. And when was that?

00:11:24MIRANDA: That was January 2012 until January 2013. I was there for an entire year.

00:11:32DAHLSTRAND: Okay. So give me a day in the life of Edgar when he's in Afghanistan.

00:11:41MIRANDA: I was with the headquarters detachment out there for the 1st Marine Division. And it's-- Well, what we did was-- Because we were the headquarters battalion detachment for the entire division, we had different units come in because-- you know-- For the division, you have all the regiments. And you have all the other specialty units that come in because even like MARSOC and everything-- They're all part of the 1st Marine Division-- and the recon guys and-- you know-- all the regimental combat teams.

00:12:21MIRANDA: So whenever they would come in-- because they had their own different cycles than we did-- That's why we were there for a year-- because we had to be there while everyone else was cycling through. And the thing is, once you do your pre-deployment training in the States-- When you get to Afghanistan, you still have to do indoctrination stuff. And you have to go over the rules of engagement-- you know, IED training, the MRAP aggression course, which is where they put you on the tumbling Humvee. We use MRAPs now. I forget what it stands for, but it looks like a giant elephant. It's awesome.

00:12:59MIRANDA: But that was our job while we were there-- to do all the in-country training for the units that were actually going to go out into-- you know, the operational-- into the battlefield. I never went on any convoys. But we did go to-- We did do all the like helicopter transports. Then, while I was there, we also were in charge of the detainees. So, whenever the patrols would go out and detain people, we would have to do the detainee at the detention center, as you can call it, and also at the hospital. So, you know, for all the people that would get hurt in their efforts to kill us-- say someone blew their leg off or something planting an IED-- Per the rules of engagement, we still have to take care of them. But we also were in charge of guarding them at the hospital.

00:14:06DAHLSTRAND: What was that like?

00:14:08MIRANDA: I mean-- For the most part, I think they knew they were defeated at that point because I mean-- You're there with, you know, someone--

00:14:19DAHLSTRAND: You're at their last worst case scenario.

00:14:23MIRANDA: Yeah. They're only there until they get sent to jail-- you know, or worse, you know. But they do have to get back in good health before they'll do anything official with them. So, but-- I don't know. I mean, I knew that I was in control kind of thing. And it was always, you know, teams of people-- like me and someone else, or me and two other someone elses. And we would just make sure they didn't get crazy. And for the most part, nothing ever really happened, except for like a couple of times where they would try to escape and stuff. And-- I mean, they're not gonna get very far when they have a foot missing. But hey, they tried.

00:15:05DAHLSTRAND: So, some people have some public misperceptions about the military. Is there any misperceptions that you would like to clarify about?

00:15:23MIRANDA: I think that some people think that people join the military because they're not smart enough to go to college. That's definitely something that I've had to deal with. But, after a while I just kind of don't listen to it because, I mean, I'm the one that's getting free tuition, so--

00:15:43DAHLSTRAND: So, when did you get out of the military?

00:15:48MIRANDA: In August, 2015.

00:15:50DAHLSTRAND: And what made you decide that it was time?

00:15:55MIRANDA: My last duty station was at Shepherd Air Force Base. I was an instructor for the Air Force at the Air Education Training Command at Shepherd Air Force Base, Texas. And I was one of like five permanent personnel marines there. Everyone else was Army or Air Force. And then we had the actual students come in from every branch except for the Navy because they had their own separate training for the same thing we were instructing.

00:16:30MIRANDA: But, it was very political. It was very different, being a Marine Sergeant at an Air Force command because-- I mean-- As Marines, we're taught to be aggressive-- to be, you know-- to yell, basically. And it's-- I mean, if you've ever seen Full Metal Jacket-- That's real. That's not an exaggeration whatsoever. That is exactly what it's like, you know, in boot camp, at least. And then for the most part, you know, there's a level of-- I mean, it sounds messed up, but a level of fear associated with junior Marines and senior NCOs-- which I was.

00:17:11MIRANDA: So for the most part, the dynamic between my students, my Marines, and myself-- and my other NCO peers-- That was very by the book. And, you know, "Yes Sergeant. No Sergeant. Aye Sergeant." Stuff like that. It was very strict, but it wasn't hazing. I guess you could say that's just the norm. That's how we are, you know? And if you mess up, you're going to get yelled at and you're probably going to cry a little bit. But hey, you know what? If you got yelled at, you probably deserved it. And for the most part, every Marine acknowledges that if they get yelled at, it's probably for a good reason-- unless you know, the NCO is just being a jerk. But for the most part, that's not how I was.

00:17:53MIRANDA: And everyone understood that. But, you know-- Having that mentality and having that go to in terms of discipline-- If I did that with Army students or Air Force students, it became an issue of my misconduct apparently. And, I mean, I do understand that-- You know-- It's not normal, now at least, to just yell at people. But at the time, that's-- Yeah, of course that's normal.

00:18:26DAHLSTRAND: It's a legitimate training style.

00:18:28MIRANDA: Yeah, exactly. And-- And the thing is-- like a lot of airmen-- they're taught to question authority. Like they are literally taught that. And they are taught to collaborate with senior leadership. And it's like, no. I don't have time to collaborate with you. You're going to do this because I told you. I assure you, I know better.

00:18:51MIRANDA: And it was just, you know-- Whenever it, you know-- It got out of hand in terms of trying to collaborate. It became disrespectful, you know? And that's something that I absolutely do not tolerate because I've already been to combat the year of operations. I've done my part. At the time I had already been in six, seven years. Like, no. It was just so off to me-- you know, their priorities. And I, in the Marine Corps-- If you like one of your subordinates, you make fun of them. And it's just-- Some people would get upset that I did that with them. You know, and it was just-- It was so messed up. And, I had gotten in trouble a few times-- A few times already for yelling at airmen, soldiers, and sometimes being overheard yelling at my Marines. You know, I had to go see the flight commander and stuff. And it was just-- You know, they told me like, "You can't do that. You can't do that."

00:19:50MIRANDA: And it got to a point where-- sorry, I know I'm like completely like all over the place-- But the reason I got out was because I figured if I'm going to get treated like a civilian, might as well be a civilian. Or if I'm expected to act like a civilian, might as well be a civilian. And, you know, in retrospect-- I do kind of-- I'm happy that I was with the Air Force for my last duty station because it did make me calm down. It did make me not be a hothead anymore. And I think that I was more prepared to leave the service because-- I mean, obviously for all the separations, classes and stuff-- I did the Air Force version because they're not going to send me somewhere else to do those classes-- because it's the same thing. But I do think that they prepared me a lot more. And they-- I knew more about the GI Bill. And I knew more about my benefits with the VA. And my disability claim was processed as soon as I got out. Everything was already processed.

00:21:01MIRANDA: And I don't know-- I think that I was a lot better off in terms of preparation when I got out than Marines in the Fleet Marine Force because there's just so many of us. Like at Camp Pendleton-- like it's a strictly Marine Corps base. It's just-- There's thousands, hundreds of thousands of Marines there. And it's just-- It's not the same. It's not the same. It's not the same--

00:21:19DAHLSTRAND: It's a different culture.

00:21:21MIRANDA: Yeah, definitely. So like, I think I was a lot more prepared to get out because a lot of-- you know-- A lot of Marines-- When they get out there, they're still in that hothead pitbull mentality. And I wasn't. And I know I had to slow down and realize what I'm doing and think clearly instead of, you know, just being pissed off at everything the way a lot of other Marines are.

00:21:46DAHLSTRAND: Okay. So then how does a East LA homesick Marine end up in Athens, Georgia?

00:22:00MIRANDA: Like many foolish young people, I was engaged. And I moved out here because that's where-- This is where he's from. And I was working on my-- I mean, my entire plan when I got out was to go to college. But obviously-- you know-- I needed to do transfer courses. And I needed to, you know, get ready to come here because I hadn't done real college coursework in almost eight years at the time. And I knew that I wasn't ready for the big university or UGA and stuff.

00:22:32MIRANDA: And I-- you know-- I definitely always intended on transferring in because-- I'm not from here obviously. But I do acknowledge that the University of Georgia is one of the best schools in the South. And being here to be with my former fiance, I knew that I wanted to go here and not any other school because if I'm going to go-- if I'm going to stay here-- I'm going to go to my best option possible. And even though we're no longer going to get married, I've already invested so much time here that I can't just leave.

00:23:15DAHLSTRAND: Yeah. So you've made it yours.

00:23:17MIRANDA: Yeah, exactly. At this point, I'm not going to let, you know, unfortunate circumstances deter me from finishing school. Because, you know, for a second I did do my own research and see if I could transfer into UCLA or USC or any of the Cal States out there-- But their transfer requirements are a lot different. And especially because you need to have certain coursework already completed before you can apply to transfer into the major. So it's just completely complicated and convoluted. And at this point, I need to stay here and finish. Because otherwise, I'm going to be held back by at least a year.

00:23:57DAHLSTRAND: So, what's your major?

00:23:59MIRANDA: Management Information Systems.

00:24:01DAHLSTRAND: Now, where are you in your program?

00:24:02MIRANDA: I actually just got accepted.

00:24:04DAHLSTRAND: Okay! So this is your first year here?

00:24:07MIRANDA: Yeah, this is my first semester here.

00:24:08DAHLSTRAND: Okay. Okay. So then, how is it being a student in a classroom again?

00:24:19MIRANDA: Well, I mean-- I was always in the classroom cause I went to Athens Tech before and to University of North Georgia, down at the Oconee campus. And the classes were a lot smaller, which was great because I have pretty bad social anxiety. But I have definitely-- I don't know-- I guess, got used to the UGA classes now. Um, yeah. I don't want to say it's not as hard as I thought it would be.

00:24:49DAHLSTRAND: Well, do you think that the military helped you prepare to be a student at UGA?

00:24:55MIRANDA: Yes, absolutely. Because I-- Like I said before, my initial schooling was about a year long in Twentynine Palms. And also, before I went to Shepherd Air Force Base, I had to go through my chief training. So that was another year in Twentynine Palms. So, I mean-- It was-- It was long years. But I've been in that academic atmosphere before where-- I'm sorry-- where it's not an option to fail kind of thing. And if you fail, there are consequences to your career.

00:25:31MIRANDA: Cause you know, if you-- If you fail any of those classes in the military training, you get sent back to like the next class-- you know-- And you have to retake that course. And depending on what your senior leadership at the schoolhouse thinks about you and your attitude toward the schooling-- I mean, they'll either send you back to your unit with your head hanging low or you get reclassed in a different job because you couldn't hack it kind of thing. So I think that coming here, you know, that's definitely the mentality that I have-- where, you know, failure is not an option whatsoever. I know that some students, you know, the younger guys-- They kind of wing it kind of thing. And I just-- I can't do that. I would much rather be well prepared for-- or overly prepared than just rely on my memory.

00:26:23DAHLSTRAND: Are you forthright about your veteran status in the classroom?

00:26:27MIRANDA: Yeah, for the most part. And I think that people already know that I'm older compared to everyone else. Um, but yeah-- I think it's, you know-- At one point or another, I've made it pretty clear that I'm a veteran. So it's-- I've never tried to hide it.

00:26:48DAHLSTRAND: Okay. Has that-- What about-- Do you have like a social life here at UGA?

00:26:56MIRANDA: I-- I try to. But I don't know-- I think I'm more introverted. I think they call it an extroverted introvert because I am very talkative. I can talk to people. I can, you know-- I like the sound of my voice kind of thing. But, I think that if I'm not obligated to be anywhere, I'm not going to go anywhere. Like I've definitely gotten to that point where if I'm not invited out somewhere, I'm just going to stay home and watch TV. But I mean, I do have some friends here. Most of them are veterans.

00:27:32MIRANDA: And it's really, you know, a handful because I hate to bring down the mood. But, you know-- Ever since my ex and I broke it off-- Like, we had a lot of the same friends and it's-- you know-- When you go through a breakup-- it's, you know-- They choose one way or another. And for the most part, I already didn't have very many friends here.

00:28:00MIRANDA: So I do try to make friends. But, I also sometimes think that I'm not fully assimilated to the SEC college life-- because I've met a couple a couple Marine veterans that go here and they're--I mean-- They're in fraternities. And they're like--

00:28:22DAHLSTRAND: Really?

00:28:23MIRANDA: Yeah. And they're like, you know, completely indoctrinated, or rather unindoctrinated from the Marine Corps. And it's-- And for the most part, the one difference that I can-- that I can clearly see is that they did four years and got out. So there's still, you know-- They're still 22, 23.

00:28:38DAHLSTRAND: Do you think there's something in that age?

00:28:40MIRANDA: Oh yeah, definitely. Yeah. Cause I mean they didn't have the-- I guess the years that I put in. And I'm not saying I'm better because I did more years, but they have an advantage when it comes to re-emerging into civilian life. Because they weren't in for as long as I was. So for me-- I'm the old-- crusty old man that, you know, gets-- you know-- can't stand drunk kids. And, you know--

00:29:10DAHLSTRAND: I bet your grades are fantastic. [Laughing]

00:29:13MIRANDA: Yeah, they are. But, I mean-- It's-- I don't know. I mean, I would like to be more socially active on campus and stuff. And that's why I ran for office for the SVA here, for the Student Emergency Salvation. Yeah, so I'm the new vice president. So that's--

00:29:40DAHLSTRAND: So tell me about how how you got introduced to this Student Veteran Resource Center.

00:29:48MIRANDA: Actually, I sought it out because I-- you know, again, being in the military-- Like I hate being unprepared. And then, when I was in Afghanistan, everything was very time critical. Everything was very-- You know-- I was essentially an underqualified project manager. Like, I was still in charge of contracts worth millions of dollars and retrograding tons of equipment back to the States. And, I mean-- There was-- I did a lot in that year. It wasn't just training. Like, that second half of the deployment was a completely different role.

00:30:19MIRANDA: But anyway, having that mentality of always being prepared-- I knew that I wanted to come to UGA. So as soon as I started going to Athens Tech and UNG, I had already made contact with Terry School of Business. And then once I actually applied to the school, there was a big-- like something on the web page about student veterans. And like, "Contact the Student Veteran Resource Center" and stuff. And so I did. And I got ahold of Ted. And I sat down with him. And we talked about how many credits do I have, what I'm trying to do.

00:31:01MIRANDA: It was-- You know-- Ted is definitely that gunny that gives a crap about you kind of thing. But he was a comissioned officer. But he's definitely like that-- that big brother that looks out for us. And I wouldn't have been as successful as I am so far at UGA if it wasn't for him. Because, I mean, I think we were talking about earlier. If you want to get things done, you have to come here. Because otherwise people will swerve you. So--

00:31:33DAHLSTRAND: How important were the educational benefits? Like the post 9/11 Montgomery GI Bill--

00:31:43MIRANDA: In terms of what?

00:31:45DAHLSTRAND: In terms of going back to school-- in terms of coming to UGA specifically--

00:31:51MIRANDA: That plays a huge role, even now. Because with the post 9/11 GI Bill, you get housing allowance monthly based on the zip code. So right now, it's about $1,300 a month. So yeah-- It's very nice just to pay your rent and utilities and all that stuff. But, I mean-- I could not-- I would not be able to go to college if it wasn't for that. And what's crazy-- Because it's based on zip code-- is if I were to go to school in LA-- like, even a community college-- All that matters is the zip code of the school. If I were to go to a community college in LA, I think I'd be getting about 2,600 a month.

00:32:37DAHLSTRAND: Really? [Laughing]

00:32:38MIRANDA: Yeah, I mean-- 1,300 sounds like a lot. But I mean, yeah. I could choose to go to community college in San Francisco-- the highest housing allowance in the Department of Defense-- and get about-- I think it's like 3,200 a month.

00:32:55DAHLSTRAND: Wow.

00:32:56MIRANDA: But everything is subjective because-- Well, I mean--That's probably what you're gonna pay in rent. Yeah, you'd be getting 3,200. But you'd probably be spending about at least 2,000 on a one-bedroom or a studio or something like that. And that's normal out there, which makes my stomach hurt now.

00:33:19DAHLSTRAND: If you were advising a marine or a soldier or an airman who's short-- and they're thinking about going back to school-- What kind of advice would you give someone who's about to come back to the civilian world?

00:33:36MIRANDA: First and foremost, I'd say, drop the attitude.

00:33:44DAHLSTRAND: What attitude?

00:33:48MIRANDA: The "I'm a veteran, so I'm better than you" attitude. "Don't talk to me, because--"

00:33:54DAHLSTRAND: Do you see that here?

00:33:55MIRANDA: Not especially. Not here. Because I think that veterans that come here understand that this isn't some podunk little school. And I think that veterans that come here are more prepared, and more mentally prepared, to come to a big SEC school. I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that UGA is considered a public Ivy League school. So it's-- This is the caliber of veterans that come here are not the typical disgruntled veterans.

00:34:26MIRANDA: But I also know that it's harder to apply here as a freshman, with no college credits as a veteran, because you still have to go through the acceptance process just like everyone else. And I think the acceptance rate here is like 40 something percent. Like 60 percent of the people that apply are not going to get accepted. And just because you're a veteran doesn't mean that you're going to get any leniency. So, I think that if you're gonna go back to school, you need to go back to community college. You need to indoctrinate yourself back into it. I keep saying that word, but you do need to because especially Marines-- like even this new softer version of Marines that we have now-- We still go through the same training. And you're literally turned into an empty vessel. And you're brainwashed. Everybody knows that.

00:35:28MIRANDA: It's not an uncommon thing. But you do need to find yourself again. And I think that a lot of veterans have-- or marine veterans-- have an issue with coming back to the civilian world. Because they are so brainwashed. And again, I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I think that's our training. And that's our style. And if you're gonna join the Marine Corps, you know what you're getting yourself into. But you do need to change. And if someone's about to get out they need to understand that just because someone has a different opinion than you on politics or something-- That doesn't mean they're a liberal snowflake. It's just-- you need to understand that people are entitled to their own opinions. And just because you serve doesn't mean that your opinion is any more valid.

00:36:17MIRANDA: So, that's definitely something that I've even gotten into, you know, debates with veterans-- because, you know, they-- Again, they think they know best. And if you're about to get out, you need to drop that attitude. You need to drop that attitude and you need to apply yourself. And you need to quit trying to, I guess, overcompensate.

00:36:39MIRANDA: But also, I think that if you're about to get out, you need to understand your veterans-- or, excuse me-- your veterans benefits. Because a lot of people don't. And that's completely-- a complete detriment. Like how do you-- You're entitled to all these things and you don't know about it? So it's-- Yeah, it's-- It's definitely-- It behooves veterans to know what you are entitled to. And I know that a lot of veterans also have this disposition to think that people getting disability benefits or any other kind of monetary benefits-- They think, "Oh, you didn't even do anything. You don't deserve these benefits." But hey, you know what? You served your country. So, I mean, there's nothing to be ashamed of.

00:37:30DAHLSTRAND: Right. So, what are the next steps for you? What's your plan? What's your end game?

00:37:37MIRANDA: My end game is to graduate by the end of the fall of 2018. I would-- I mean, I only have like 39 credits to go. But for my major, there are a lot of-- Or rather there are like sequential classes. So-- I mean, there's no possible way that I could even graduate sooner because I can't take certain classes until I take the other class.

00:38:01MIRANDA: So, I mean-- At this point, I'm only going to be taking 12 credits per semester because that's all I need. But, you know-- And I am going to run out of GI Bill benefits by the time I graduate, fortunately. But, I mean-- I also want to go to law school. So I'm going to have to pay out of pocket for that, which is-- I mean, it's fine because I mean-- From the outside looking in, I'm still having a lot less student debt than everyone else. So, I mean three years of law school versus a complete undergrad degree-- or combined rather.

00:38:45DAHLSTRAND: So why law school?

00:38:48MIRANDA: I think that the current executive branch is going to cause a lot of distress in minority families-- 'cause I am first generation American. I'm not-- My parents came here from Mexico. They are, you know-- I mean, they're citizens. But I mean, they got their citizenship back in like the 60s-- back when it was completely different. And you know, that's great for them. But with everything going on now-- I just-- I feel helpless. I hate reading the news and seeing all these things happening and it's-- I want to go to law school because I want to be able to act on injustices kind of thing.

00:39:37DAHLSTRAND: So you're still serving.

00:39:39MIRANDA: Yeah, I want to continue serving in a different way. I do. I mean, I-- Even in the military, when I was in the Marine Corps, it was-- I would see people get the short end of the stick kind of thing due to loopholes and technicalities. And I just-- it sucks because I-- They can't do anything, I can't do anything. And, especially with like my family and stuff I read on Facebook-- And for the most part, all my aunts and uncles-- you know, my mom's generation-- They're all-- They're all legal-- I guess if you will-- They all have their citizenship.

00:40:19MIRANDA: But there are a few that are friends of family or older cousins or extended family that are not legal. I've-- It's been maybe like two or three times that I'm reading on Facebook where my cousins or my aunts or someone says, "Hey watch out! INS is over at the supermarket." And it's just like-- Like this is just horrible.

00:40:44MIRANDA: I mean, I understand the problem that illegal immigration brings-- but you know, people that have lived here for years and years and years-- And even like my stepmom-- She was deported at one point. You know, she finally got-- She got deported and then she got her citizenship and came here. But that was like a span of like three years-- From the time they sent her back to the time she got back was about three years. And it's just-- It's insane. And I want to be able to help because it's just-- It's insane. Like a lot of these people are just, if not more patriotic toward the U.S. than natural born citizens. Like my stepdad-- Like he's Salvadorian and he's-- He has an American flag in front of the house. And it's just-- I don't know-- I want to be able to fix things. And I don't like feeling helpless.

00:41:55DAHLSTRAND: Okay. I want to see if you had-- You mentioned before this interview started that you-- You called yourself a "don't ask, don't tell" vet. So, can you explain that?

00:42:10MIRANDA: I'm not sure when the policy came into effect. I know it was during the Clinton administration-- so like '93-- something like that. But I remember going to MEPS to do all the in-processing stuff. And there was a piece of paper that you had to sign that said, "Under no circumstances will you ever talk about your sexual orientation or, you know, get married or be in a relationship." Or, like-- Basically telling you you can't be gay, which is-- At the time, I guess it was the norm. Everyone knew that. And once it was finally repealed, it was completely different. It was-- A lot of people would make fun of people being gay or whatever. But they would never say anything to your face. And I think--

00:43:03DAHLSTRAND: So you were active duty when the repeal went into effect?

00:43:08MIRANDA: Yeah, yeah.

00:43:09DAHLSTRAND: Okay. And so seeing it from both sides-- What was that like?

00:43:16MIRANDA: I know there were a lot of service members that still didn't come out kind of thing. But a lot of them were higher ranking officers or just-- I guess people that still felt that they-- It was none of anyone's business kind of thing-- which is fine, whatever. That's your prerogative. But for me, I remember when I was in Japan. Again, I was very homesick. And even when I was at Twentynine Palms-- When I was younger, I would come home to L.A.. And I would go out to the bars in West Hollywood. And I was always still kind of active in the gay scene kind of thing.

00:43:55MIRANDA: And then when I went to Japan, I made my own friends out there that were also gay. But a lot of them were in different services. 'Cause they were all services on the island. So a lot of them were Navy. Some were Air Force. Some were Army. And I think maybe a couple Marines. And that was during "Don't Ask, Don't Tell". And I remember that I had to-- I never really built any real camaraderie with my shop because I wanted to hang out with my gay friends kind of thing. And I couldn't ever say anything. It was-- It kind of sucked. And it also conveyed to my shop that I didn't like them or that I didn't want to hang out with them. And I mean, it wasn't that. It was just that--

00:44:48DAHLSTRAND: You literally couldn't tell them why.

00:44:51MIRANDA: Yeah, exactly. I couldn't and yeah-- That was one of the hardest things that-- I've never been ashamed of who I am, but I do-- I acknowledge that legally, I couldn't say anything. I just-- I couldn't. And what's funny is-- From the people that I served with out in Japan-- They still are in shock that I'm gay. And it's just like, "How come you didn't say anything?" Well, I couldn't say anything. I just couldn't. And I remember--

00:45:23DAHLSTRAND: Do you keep in touch with people that you served with?

00:45:24MIRANDA: Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's mostly on Facebook and stuff. But I mean, some I do call. Or they call me. Or we text and stuff. But yeah-- For the most part, we do still talk. Or something will remind me of them. And I'll text them or something. So, I mean-- It's a lot different than-- you're saying the civil war period. I mean, we don't write letters or anything. It's a lot easier to keep in touch. But yeah. And then-- That was the case during and then after I-- Once it was repealed and stuff, I told everyone cause I-- This was in my chief's course when I was in 29th Public second time. So all my peers were the same rank. They're all sergeants or staff sergeants. And we were all in class together and stuff. And I told everybody. And I think--

00:46:13DAHLSTRAND: What was that like?

00:46:15MIRANDA: It was-- It was great. I mean, I could finally be myself kind of thing. And, you know, I didn't have to-- cause if I'm dating someone, I can't ever bring them around my friends. And for the most part, I did come out to some people while I was in-- while I was during Don't Ask, Don't Tell. But it was-- it was a risk that you were taking because if someone wants to say something, they can. And, you know. An investigation will ensue.

00:46:46MIRANDA: And I have two friends. We were this-- We were peers in Japan. They were outed by someone that was vindictive. And they had a proof. And they were administratively separated. And they don't get the GI Bill. They don't get all these other benefits that they're entitled to. And I mean, it sucks. And a lot of them-- there are other people also that have been in forever-- some colonels and sergeants major. They spent their entire life in the military. And then someone has proof of them being gay. And suddenly, it's all down the drain. Like that was a complete injustice that I'm glad is not here anymore.

00:47:36MIRANDA: I'm glad it finally went away. And I knew that a lot of people were resistant toward it. But I also, from my own experience, know that the reason people are so resistant toward it-- you know, gays in the military-- is that they've never met a gay person. They have never met a gay person or they think that all gay people are flamboyant, purse wearing guys. And I do have friends like that that are in the military. Like one of my best friends is still serving now and he is gayer than Christmas. But I love him. I love him.

00:48:07MIRANDA: He is himself. And when he's in uniform, obviously he's-- He has a different demeanor. But I mean, it doesn't matter who you are. And that's one of the reasons why, especially being in Georgia and the Bible Belt-- like it's-- I don't have any designated religion that I practice at all. I don't want to say that I'm atheist. I do acknowledge-- I guess the term would be agnostic. I just don't believe in these ridiculous rules of organized religion. I think that all you have to do is be a good person. And that's all that matters.

00:48:48MIRANDA: And I know that after I-- After I came out to some people, they even told me themselves that I changed their perspective on the gay community because I wasn't like them. And I'm like-- And I did-- I did also school people on that too because I remember there was one of my staff sergeants, you know, a rank higher than me. He was like, "No, I'm very tolerant." And I was like, "Whoa!" Like, that word alone just annoys the crap out of me because I'm-- Tolerance--

00:49:31DAHLSTRAND: --Implies that something needs to be tolerated.

00:49:34MIRANDA: Exactly. Yeah, exactly. Like no-- Like tolerance-- no. Acceptance is more the better word because when you're tolerating-- Like you're tolerating a toddler having a tantrum-- Like, you're tolerating someone's annoying voice. Like, it's just-- I don't like that word. And I don't think that I'm something to be tolerated. And I mean-- I've never been, at least to my face, been ostracized for my sexual orientation.

00:49:35MIRANDA: But I mean-- I'm not going to hide it because I know that there are a lot of people, especially in the South, that are afraid to come out. And I'm not-- I mean. Some people think that I should be, but I'm not. I mean-- At this point, I've served my country, been to Afghanistan, done my part. I-- I've done things that other people, non-gay people, have never done. Like, they would never sign their life off with the chance of getting killed. And I'm not saying that I'm better.

00:50:41DAHLSTRAND: You get to be gay and patriotic. How awesome is that?

00:50:45MIRANDA: Yeah, exactly. And that's another reason why I wanted to be a lawyer too-- Because, I mean-- It's-- There are so many injustices in the world with immigration and with LGBT issues and-- Veteran issues, like it's--

00:51:00DAHLSTRAND: So, have you-- Just-- Just like-- You're active with the Student Veteran Resource Center. Do you work with the LGBT community at UGA at all?

00:51:10MIRANDA: No. I have not had a chance to do that. I've been pretty busy, but I will look into it because, again-- I do think that--

00:51:21DAHLSTRAND: It's right downstairs.

00:51:22MIRANDA: Is it really? Yeah, no-- I haven't-- I've been so busy because all my classes are back-to-back. And I just haven't. And I should.

00:51:32DAHLSTRAND: Last question-- For the historian 100 years from now, what final thoughts do you want to share on your experience as a veteran here at UGA?

00:51:49MIRANDA: Um-- I don't know.

00:51:53DAHLSTRAND: Is there something you want people to know? Like some misperception you want to clarify?

00:52:03MIRANDA: Don't be afraid to be yourself. Don't do something that doesn't make you happy. And don't sacrifice your happiness for anyone else.

00:52:20DAHLSTRAND: Awesome. Well, thank you very much.

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